Dave's first argument
The inhabitants of the city of Berea, though not even Christians when Paul first preached the gospel to them, "searched the scriptures daily, [to see] whether those things [Paul preached] were so" (Acts:17:11) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.)—and they were commended as "noble" for doing so. Yet leading Calvinists insist that it requires special (and apparently lengthy) preparation for anyone to become qualified to examine that peculiar doctrine in light of the Bible. Why?
After all, the Bible itself declares that a "young man" can understand its instructions and thereby "cleanse his way" (Psalm:119:9) Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.). Even a child can know the Holy Scriptures through home instruction from a mother and grandmother (2 Timothy:1:5) When I call to remembrance the unfeigned faith that is in thee, which dwelt first in thy grandmother Lois, and thy mother Eunice; and I am persuaded that in thee also.; 3:15). Timothy was certainly not a seminary-trained theologian, yet Paul considered him competent to study and "rightly divide" God’s Word. If special expertise were required to test Calvinism against Scripture, that would be proof enough that this peculiar doctrine did not come from valid biblical exegesis. Anything that enigmatic, by very definition, could not have been derived from the Bible, which itself claims to be written for the simple.
In contrast, “Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein” (Luke:18:16-17
).
Should
Calvinism remain a mystery for the common Christian? That very fact, if
true, would be additional proof that Calvinism was not derived from the
Scriptures. How could something so complicated possibly come from that
upon which every person is capable of meditating day and night (Psalm:1:1–2),
and joyfully received—even by a “little child”? If the essential
nourishment God’s Word provides is to be every man’s daily sustenance
for spiritual life (Deuteronomy:8:3),
could Calvinism really be the biblical gospel and biblical Christianity
and yet be so difficult for the ordinary Christian to understand?
RESPONSE
the thrust of the argument is that "anyone can understand the bible with no aid or hep from theologians, scholars or any other body of support" ... .. this argument is without merit since it is not the Calvinist point of view that you need all of this to understand the bible ... though sometimes it can be a good thing to better your understanding on some topics ... this is a plain mistake ... the Calvinists point is no one can truly understand the bible apart from the work of the spirit in ones life .. and a deep study of all given topics in question
granted on some issues there is not such a need for a deep study ... like heaven and hell ... just a few months of study ... even a few hours can reveal these truths to us ... but is that the case for biblical truths like the Trinity, Justification, which do take some serious study to full understand .. as to avoid false views of modalism .. which the untrained person can slip into .. just look at Muslim apologist who continuously mistake the two. and then with justification there are two views the roman catholic view .. where it is change in the person .. this is primarily due to the fact they do not distinguish between justification / sanctification ... but protestant have done for 500 years now
the first is the act of have a rightousness credited to ur account, it is a covering, the second the transformation work of the spirit in a believers life
so there is a deep need and desire for real balanced study which involves going deep into the text
now the six texts in question
1) The inhabitants of the city of Berea, though not even Christians when Paul first preached the gospel to them, "searched the scriptures daily, [to see] whether those things [Paul preached] were so" (Acts:17:11) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.)—and they were commended as "noble" for doing so
i am trying to figure out why this even comes up at all ... there are obvious problems presenting themselves in this ideal understand .... these people searched the scriptures daily to confirm if what Paul was being truthful .. what does the text reveal to us
10 As soon as it was night, the believers sent Paul and Silas away to Berea. On arriving there, they went to the Jewish synagogue. 11 Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. 12 As a result, many of them believed, as did also a number of prominent Greek women and many Greek men
note what Paul states of these men ... "Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. " ...... they examined .. meaning they studied the facts of the case this was not just just a momentary thing where they compared notes and then said its true .. no, they took pains to make sure everything was accurately handled by Paul ...
and as a result of this study, an in depth one .. the spirit of God convicted them and they believed in Christ .. the spirit and the word of God are a connective in bring people to the true faith in Christ
we also must ask what made these particular people more noble than the people in thessalonica ... perhaps it is found in the fact they were not as easy in their undertaking of fact .. they studied relentlessly to acquire the the truth , but those in thessalonica did not
compare this too what Paul states else where .. for example ...
Do not quench the Spirit. 20 Do not treat prophecies with contempt 21 but test them all; hold on to what is good, 22 reject every kind of evil.-- 1 Thessalonians 5 :19 -22
these verse are significant in helping us to fully appreciate the place of deep study has in the faith .... note the words .... "Do not quench the Spirit. Do not treat prophecies with contempt " ... the word prophecy here does not solely refer to the prophecy in Scripture as in the predictive knowledge of God ... but rather encompasses a wider meaning ... the word of God .. every statement .. think of john 6 :45, and Ephesians 6 where we see the spirit and the word of God being linked together in our lives as believers ...
this point john Calvin also made in his commentary on these words
20 Despise
not prophesyings. This sentence is appropriately added to the preceding
one, for as the Spirit of God illuminates us chiefly by doctrine, those
who give not teaching its proper place, do, so far as in them lies,
quench the Spirit, for we must always consider in what manner or by what
means God designs to communicate himself to us. Let every one,
therefore, who is desirous to make progress under the direction of the
Holy Spirit, allow himself to be taught by the ministry of prophets.
By the term prophecy, however, I do not understand the gift of foretelling the future, but as in 1 Corinthians 14:3, the science of interpreting Scripture, so
that a prophet is an interpreter of the will of God. For Paul, in the
passage which I have quoted, assigns to prophets teaching for
edification, exhortation, and consolation, and enumerates, as it were,
these departments. Let, therefore, prophecy in this passage be
understood as meaning — interpretation made suitable to present use. “Interpretation de l’Escriture applicquee proprement selon le temps, les personnes, et les choses presentes;” — “Interpretation of Scripture properly applied, according to time, persons, and things present.” Paul prohibits us from despising it, if we would not choose of our own accord to wander in darkness.
The
statement, however, is a remarkable one, for the commendation of
external preaching. It is the dream of fanatics, that those are children
who continue to employ themselves in the reading of the Scripture, or
the hearing of the word, as if no one were spiritual, unless he is a
despiser of doctrine. They proudly, therefore, despise the ministry of
man, nay, even Scripture itself, that they may attain the Spirit.
Farther, whatever delusions Satan suggests to them, “Leur souffle aux aureilles;” — “Breathes into their ears.” they presumptuously set forth as secret revelations of the Spirit. Such are the Libertines, See Calvin on the Corinthians, and
other furies of that stamp. And the more ignorant that any one is, he
is puffed up and swollen out with so much the greater arrogance. Let us,
however, learn from the example of Paul, to conjoin the Spirit with the
voice of men, which is nothing else than his organ. “L’organe et instrument d’celuy;” — “His organ and instrument.”
here we see john calvin making the same point that i have above that this passage ,,, is speaking of deep studies of the bible inorder to know the truths they present
without such studies no man can accurately handle the bible or truly represent the faith
Prove all things…
That are said by the prophets, all the doctrines which they deliver; hear them, though they have not the gift of tongues, and all desirable advantages; do not reject them on that account, and refuse to hear them, for so, many useful men may be laid aside, and the Spirit of God in them be quenched; try their gifts, and attend to their doctrines, yet do not implicitly believe everything they say, but examine them according to the word of God the test and standard of truth; search the Scriptures, whether the things they say are true or not. Not openly erroneous persons, and known heretics, are to be heard and attended on, but the ministers of the word, or such who are said to have a gift of prophesying; these should make use of it, and the church should try and judge their gift, and accordingly encourage or discourage; and also their doctrines, and if false reject them, and if true receive them. Hold fast that which is good;
honest, pleasant, profitable, and agreeable to sound doctrine, to the analogy of faith, and the Scriptures of truth, and is useful and edifying, instructive both as to principle and practice; such should be held fast, that no man take it away; and be retained, though a majority may be against it, for the multitude is not always on the side of truth; and though it may be rejected by men of learning and wealth, as Christ and his doctrines were rejected by the Scribes and Pharisees, and rulers of the people; and though it may be reproached as a novel, upstart notion, or a licentious one, since these were charges against the doctrine of Christ, and his apostles; and though it may be attended with affliction and persecution, yet none of these things should move from it, or cause to let it go.
That are said by the prophets, all the doctrines which they deliver; hear them, though they have not the gift of tongues, and all desirable advantages; do not reject them on that account, and refuse to hear them, for so, many useful men may be laid aside, and the Spirit of God in them be quenched; try their gifts, and attend to their doctrines, yet do not implicitly believe everything they say, but examine them according to the word of God the test and standard of truth; search the Scriptures, whether the things they say are true or not. Not openly erroneous persons, and known heretics, are to be heard and attended on, but the ministers of the word, or such who are said to have a gift of prophesying; these should make use of it, and the church should try and judge their gift, and accordingly encourage or discourage; and also their doctrines, and if false reject them, and if true receive them. Hold fast that which is good;
honest, pleasant, profitable, and agreeable to sound doctrine, to the analogy of faith, and the Scriptures of truth, and is useful and edifying, instructive both as to principle and practice; such should be held fast, that no man take it away; and be retained, though a majority may be against it, for the multitude is not always on the side of truth; and though it may be rejected by men of learning and wealth, as Christ and his doctrines were rejected by the Scribes and Pharisees, and rulers of the people; and though it may be reproached as a novel, upstart notion, or a licentious one, since these were charges against the doctrine of Christ, and his apostles; and though it may be attended with affliction and persecution, yet none of these things should move from it, or cause to let it go.
here john gill also agree that deep study is a neccasary addition ... since we can not truly represent christ in the manner of throwing out most of the bible based on select verses, even dramatically altered or cut up verse, we are too deal with every passage honestly and sincerely
as we have to note the following points about this article of daves .. the bible is being dishonour with these level of understand, and is being disrespected in tems of how one utilises it
dave hunts apprach is very similar to jehovah witness, mormans and muslim on this factor .. pick and choose verse, ignore the text and meaning of the passage
2) Psalm:119:9 "After all, the Bible itself declares that a "young man" can understand its instructions and thereby "cleanse his way" (Psalm:119:9) Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.)
to this point we have not seen any indication that dave truly understands our position let alone the bible as a whole ... lets just consider the passage for a moment ... what does it say ... does it actually say any man can read and understand it or does it take a certian type of person to do this ... a regenerated person
who walk in the law of the Lord!
2 Blessed are those who keep his testimonies,
who seek him with their whole heart,
3 who also do no wrong,
but walk in his ways!
4 You have commanded your precepts
to be kept diligently.
5 Oh that my ways may be steadfast
in keeping your statutes!
6 Then I shall not be put to shame,
having my eyes fixed on all your commandments.
7 I will praise you with an upright heart,
when I learn your righteous rules.
8 I will keep your statutes;
do not utterly forsake me!
as we start with this section it is helpful for us to take everything the bible has to offer .. for example when the writer hear says "Blessed are those whose way is blameless, who walk in the law of the Lord!" .. we should understand that this primarily is speaking of the faithful believer .. in this instance the Jew .. and overall the Jews and Christians as the law is in both backgrounds .... but we also need to understand no man is able to keep the law in and of himself as the new testament declares .. in the Gospel as it is holy and just and man is sinful by nature and the law reveal this .. so something has to happen in order to keep us in line with Gods ways which is a supernatural act .. regeneration and the out work of the spirit
every part of these lines has to be understood in light of all scripture, this is vitally important .. if one writer states "Blessed are those who keep his testimonies, who seek him with their whole heart" and another writer states "None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands;
no one seeks for God" .. are we to assume there is a contradiction or should we try to understand the second as a universal given that no man before the supernatural act is able to seek after God, and the other writer is stating a given truth that only those who have been supernaturally awaken by God can seek after God in all they do ... the natural man can not do such thing, the spiritual can .
the rest of these verse practically show us this truth .. that man aided by Gods spirit is able to live by his law .. but the man who is not can not .. "You have commanded your precepts to be kept diligently. Oh that my ways may be steadfast in keeping your statutes!" .. we take the examples of David and Solomon who were kings and both fell into the practise of breaking the law .. David committed adultery and had a man killed and the punishment was that his new born son would be taken away from him as in killed as punishment .. and Solomon committed idolatry both of these instances reveal the importance of Gods law .. and this has not changed in the new covenant .. instead they have redefine as spiritual act as well as physical ... as the lord said in regards of adultery and murder ... even if the thought of either enters into your mind you have already committed the acts
Beth
9 How can a young man keep his way pure?
By guarding it according to your word.
10 With my whole heart I seek you;
let me not wander from your commandments!
11 I have stored up your word in my heart,
that I might not sin against you.
12 Blessed are you, O Lord;
teach me your statutes!
13 With my lips I declare
all the rules of your mouth.
14 In the way of your testimonies I delight
as much as in all riches.
15 I will meditate on your precepts
and fix my eyes on your ways.
16 I will delight in your statutes;
I will not forget your word.
here in the first 2 verse we have a plea mad which is significant to the understand of Gods work in our lives .. and how is able to keep us in obedience, and yet we too remain obedient to his laws .. in these words "let me not wander from your commandments" ... here the writer is not saying he will do his best to keep the law and walk in but he is asking of the Lord for supernatural guidance in this task ... let me not...such an important point that we can not allow it to slip out of mind or sight
in verse 11 we have these words " I have stored up your word in my heart, that I might not sin against you" ... it is the wonderful truth when man has the Lords words in his heart .. his mind is focused on the Lord and his ways that he wont sin against the lord , but even so we must understand that this is only for those are in the lord truly .. no man can seek the lord on his own as scripture makes clear .. by in the spirit all things are possible we seek the lord through the spirit ... as Paul tells us in Romans 8 and 1 Corinthians 2
a true believer can and should appreciate such words of encouragement when it comes to the Lord word .. "In the way of your testimonies I delight as much as in all riches" ... the law is not just a set of laws, or boundaries but simply put is a way of life ... and it is the manner to which a Jew could know he was pleasing to the lord .... but even the most faithful could not help sinning as many did .. the law was also an aid to understand God supreme holiness, his sovereign ruler ship in that of his creation, as well as the fallen nature of
so we see that this psalm is a beautiful declaration of Gods revealed truths ... which one needs sufficient studies to fully understand even thee basic element of the law ... what are the distinctives of the law .. why do Muslims for example misrepresent them .. because they do not read to understand, they read to justify a filthy life style
so
there is an importance of reading and studying for deeper understanding
of biblical truth this is one thing the new testament agrees with
i
believe a good point to reflect upon when considering these sections
from psalm 119 .. is that there is a double line in the sands, so to
speak ... the laws of the lord are to be seen in the highest regard ...
they almost beyond approach in man .... as they amplify Gods holinessthe other thing is that in see the holiness of the lord through his laws, man can not help but see his own imperfection just that of Isaiah in Isaiah 6 ... we fall way too short of Gods perfect laws
3) 2 Timothy:1:5 "Even a child can know the Holy Scriptures through home instruction from a mother and grandmother (2 Timothy:1:5) When I call to remembrance the unfeigned faith that is in thee, which dwelt first in thy grandmother Lois, and thy mother Eunice; and I am persuaded that in thee also.; 3:15). Timothy was certainly not a seminary-trained theologian, yet Paul considered him competent to study and "rightly divide" God’s Word"
here we are with a rabbit trail .... think about what Dave is saying here a man with no prior biblical knowledge can pick up the bible and start teaching its truths ... this again is a false premises on many fronts .. just list a few areas
1) timothy was not just a normal person ... he had two trainers in his ministry .. the first being the holy spirit of God who is the author and the true exegegte of the scriptures, and next to that he had the apostles of our lord .. Paul , peter and john... just how many teachers did he have ... he had the best
2) just because this one believer new the scripture from young does not mean every person therefore could know them .. certainly all Jews did .. but that is a far cry from say all men did and it certainly does not mean all men can
there
is a good reason why exegesis is so crucial in this ... and a good
proper understanding .. lets see the context of the passages in question
For this reason I remind you to fan into flame the gift of God, which is in you through the laying on of my hands. 7 For the Spirit God gave us does not make us timid, but gives us power, love and self-discipline. 8 So do not be ashamed of the testimony about our Lord or of me his prisoner. Rather, join with me in suffering for the gospel, by the power of God. 9 He has saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time, 10 but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has destroyed death and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. 11 And of this gospel I was appointed a herald and an apostle and a teacher. 12 That is why I am suffering as I am. Yet this is no cause for shame, because I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him until that day. 13 What you heard from me, keep as the pattern of sound teaching, with faith and love in Christ Jesus. 14 Guard the good deposit that was entrusted to you—guard it with the help of the Holy Spirit who lives in us .... .2 timothy 1
You, however, know all about my teaching, my way of life, my purpose, faith, patience, love, endurance, 11 persecutions,
sufferings—what kinds of things happened to me in Antioch, Iconium and
Lystra, the persecutions I endured. Yet the Lord rescued me from all of
them. 12 In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, 13 while evildoers and impostors will go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. 14 But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15 and
how from infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to
make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. -2 timothy 3
the
main thing to note is that Paul does not say any child can understand
the gospel in the way that it will lead him to salvation in Christ ...
far from the actually point in Paul words here , if this was the case
then why does this thing not happen to every person .. if this is all it
takes
because of a simple five lettered word .. "GRACE"
for true God given understanding of scripture something must take place
first .. which will enable us to really understand the gospel
and
this two passages give us the real flow from the context .. if we
consider the first passage as the basis of the second we get this ...
timothy could truly see the old testament was testifying to the
salvation in Christ .. he came to this through diligent study which the
spirit of God enabled him to do
consider these words "What you heard from me, keep as the pattern of sound teaching, with faith and love in Christ Jesus. 14 Guard the good deposit that was entrusted to you—guard it with the help of the Holy Spirit who lives in us "
so
the young timothy .. was able to come to these conclusion of Jesus
being the saviour by 2 means the spirit and the word of God .. the
spirit open him to understand the scripture he had known from childhood
in the manner God designed them to be seen
we also have some good indications that deep study is a much needed benefit ...
4) In contrast, “Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein” (Luke:18:16-17).
so the whole issue at this point is the Christianity that Dave believes in or sees in the select few scriptures he cites ... are of an easily understood form .. even a child could understand it before addressing the comments we need to understand the passage more
15 People were also bringing babies to Jesus for him to place his hands on them. When the disciples saw this, they rebuked them. 16 But Jesus called the children to him and said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. 17 Truly I tell you, anyone who will not receive the kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it.”
here we see Dave is misrepresenting the passage since what Jesus is making a point of is that the kingdom is not for people who are proud, boastful, prideful, and more importantly not self righteous
it is important for us to take note of the term "for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these" .. for he is saying that for one to enter they have to be like infants who depend on him alone for the true assurance ... where as many in this point were not depending on him in a fashion that was pleasing to the father
we also see an important connection in this this section too .. Matthew 11
Then Jesus began to denounce the towns in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent. 21 “Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you. 23 And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades, For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day. 24 But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.”
25 At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; 26 yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 27 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him. 28 Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.”.”
we also have some good indications that deep study is a much needed benefit ...
for example ....
If any of you lacks wisdom, you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you. 6 But when you ask, you must believe and not doubt, because the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. 7 That person should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. 8 Such a person is double-minded and unstable in all they do.... James 1
Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. 23 Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like someone who looks at his face in a mirror 24 and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. 25 But whoever looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues in it—not forgetting what they have heard, but doing it—they will be blessed in what they do. ... James 1
here
James the brother of the LORD gives us two positive commands ... a) to
ask for wisdom once in the faith, and not to doubt .... wisdom is the
ability to understand discern between facts
b)
once you have that understanding .. he also says to be able to build
upon known one must be fully immersed in the word .. never forget it
these
thing take time, and essentially come from deep study of the word
through the work of the spirit ... so the point here is that Gods word
is not be some light type of essay that you forget, but is to become the
very essence of your whole life
4) In contrast, “Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein” (Luke:18:16-17).
so the whole issue at this point is the Christianity that Dave believes in or sees in the select few scriptures he cites ... are of an easily understood form .. even a child could understand it before addressing the comments we need to understand the passage more
15 People were also bringing babies to Jesus for him to place his hands on them. When the disciples saw this, they rebuked them. 16 But Jesus called the children to him and said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. 17 Truly I tell you, anyone who will not receive the kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it.”
here we see Dave is misrepresenting the passage since what Jesus is making a point of is that the kingdom is not for people who are proud, boastful, prideful, and more importantly not self righteous
it is important for us to take note of the term "for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these" .. for he is saying that for one to enter they have to be like infants who depend on him alone for the true assurance ... where as many in this point were not depending on him in a fashion that was pleasing to the father
we also see an important connection in this this section too .. Matthew 11
Then Jesus began to denounce the towns in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent. 21 “Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you. 23 And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades, For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day. 24 But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.”
25 At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; 26 yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 27 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him. 28 Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.”.”
here we have the perfect example of how the arminian traditions and the universalist tradition falls flat upon biblical truth of predestination / election ... while it may seem that some of this speaks of mans choose to accept or reject the invitation .. there is a slight problem when these words are thought upon ... " Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children" ... note the connection now .... it please the father for those who are like infants to reveal the truth to them .... but also note that these things had been kept hidden from people like the wise and understanding ... mean Dave's premise of anyone can understand is blown apart .. those who come to him for eternal rest are the ones who are like infant .. they depend upon him alone
5) "Should Calvinism remain a mystery for the common Christian? That very fact, if true, would be additional proof that Calvinism was not derived from the Scriptures. How could something so complicated possibly come from that upon which every person is capable of meditating day and night (Psalm:1:1–2), and joyfully received—even by a “little child”?"
again we are met with a very hostile attitude ... with this in mind there are a few things in this that can be seen ... a) Dave clear does not understand Calvinism, nor the bible he quotes , b) this full of many interesting but nevertheless unbiblical propositions
first of all let see the passage in question to see what it is saying ...
Blessed is the man
who walks not in counsel of the wicked,
nor stands in the way of sinners,
nor sits in the seat of scoffers;
2 but his delight is in the law of the Lord,
and on his law he meditates day and night.
3 He is like a tree
planted by streams of water
that yields its fruit in its season,
and its leaf does not wither.
In all that he does, he prospers.
4 The wicked are not so,
but are like chaff that the wind drives away.
planted by streams of water
that yields its fruit in its season,
and its leaf does not wither.
In all that he does, he prospers.
4 The wicked are not so,
but are like chaff that the wind drives away.
Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgement,
nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous;6 for the Lord knows the way of the righteous, but the way of the wicked will perish.
nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous;6 for the Lord knows the way of the righteous, but the way of the wicked will perish.
note
that this is a very short psalm and is direct to its point at hand that
being a contrast of the righteous believer and the wicked unbeliever
... and how the one who is saved has the very spirit of God guiding him
through his days and the law has been written upon his heart (Ezekiel
11, 36) this is also noted in the new testament in john 3 and other
places .... but back to the psalm as there is more we need to take on
board .. Paul in Romans 8 :1 -8 also make a similar appeal to this kind
of understanding
so
what is hard for Dave to see in this that does not show every man, but
the believer who delights in the law of the lord, and it is because of
the work of the spirit of God in them that this is made possible
this
whole point reveals Dave's traditions are blinding him to the truth, he
neither understands or cares for the biblical truth that Calvinist
adhere too
lets consider this point too .... "nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous" if
the wicked can not be apart of the congregation who meditate upon the
law and live in its beautiful .. what does this leave the wicked to do
.. as they can not do what the believers do
is
it Dave's position that they too can meditate upon the law, even though
Paul says that it is impossible for them do just this thing in Romans 8
7 -8
the
very fact that Calvinism .. or the doctrines of grace are found in the
bible as a whole is not the issue... the issue here is that your
misrepresentation and straw men are not biblical ... and that is what
you are objecting against your own straw men attacks thinking they are
what we believe
the
doctrines on the other hand are true despite your constant objection
too .. it is like the deity of Christ and trinity just because many
object against them, these truth do not become non existent based on
their conclusions
and the same is true of the doctrines of grace
6) If the essential nourishment God’s Word provides is to be every man’s daily sustenance for spiritual life (Deuteronomy:8:3),
it is hard to even see how Dave can use the bible against Calvinists when the bible is the very instrument that we ourselves go to ... what is more depressing in this attack is that Dave does not see how inconsistent he is being .. by not applying his traditions to the test
but speaking of this text from duet 8 :3 we do not have a problem with it as the word of God is our source of life .. we believe in what it teaches .. the spirit and the word are an active force in our daily lives
now for the context ...
Be careful to follow every command I am giving you today, so that you may live and increase and may enter and possess the land the Lord promised on oath to your ancestors. 2 Remember how the Lord your God led you all the way in the wilderness these forty years, to humble and test you in order to know what was in your heart, whether or not you would keep his commands. 3 He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord. 4 Your clothes did not wear out and your feet did not swell during these forty years. 5 Know then in your heart that as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you.
6 Observe the commands of the Lord your God, walking in obedience to him and revering him. 7 For the Lord your God is bringing you into a good land—a land with brooks, streams, and deep springs gushing out into the valleys and hills; 8 a land with wheat and barley, vines and fig trees, pomegranates, olive oil and honey; 9 a land where bread will not be scarce and you will lack nothing; a land where the rocks are iron and you can dig copper out of the hills.
here is the context ... and what do we learn it is a warning to Israel to not forget their LORD ... God very word is at stake in this passage .. the Jews are being told to never forsake the word of the lord .. the true life of God .. to abide in his word was the very means of living in God
here is an important point "He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord"
here we get the true value of what Gods word is ... through partaking of the manna .. which is physical reality of spiritual truth in Christ ... Christ is the living bread that we are saved unto
but we can also see that Christ makes this passage important by quoting the tail end of verse 3 in his temptations
6) If the essential nourishment God’s Word provides is to be every man’s daily sustenance for spiritual life (Deuteronomy:8:3),
it is hard to even see how Dave can use the bible against Calvinists when the bible is the very instrument that we ourselves go to ... what is more depressing in this attack is that Dave does not see how inconsistent he is being .. by not applying his traditions to the test
but speaking of this text from duet 8 :3 we do not have a problem with it as the word of God is our source of life .. we believe in what it teaches .. the spirit and the word are an active force in our daily lives
now for the context ...
Be careful to follow every command I am giving you today, so that you may live and increase and may enter and possess the land the Lord promised on oath to your ancestors. 2 Remember how the Lord your God led you all the way in the wilderness these forty years, to humble and test you in order to know what was in your heart, whether or not you would keep his commands. 3 He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord. 4 Your clothes did not wear out and your feet did not swell during these forty years. 5 Know then in your heart that as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you.
6 Observe the commands of the Lord your God, walking in obedience to him and revering him. 7 For the Lord your God is bringing you into a good land—a land with brooks, streams, and deep springs gushing out into the valleys and hills; 8 a land with wheat and barley, vines and fig trees, pomegranates, olive oil and honey; 9 a land where bread will not be scarce and you will lack nothing; a land where the rocks are iron and you can dig copper out of the hills.
here is the context ... and what do we learn it is a warning to Israel to not forget their LORD ... God very word is at stake in this passage .. the Jews are being told to never forsake the word of the lord .. the true life of God .. to abide in his word was the very means of living in God
here is an important point "He humbled you, causing you to hunger and then feeding you with manna, which neither you nor your ancestors had known, to teach you that man does not live on bread alone but on every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord"
here we get the true value of what Gods word is ... through partaking of the manna .. which is physical reality of spiritual truth in Christ ... Christ is the living bread that we are saved unto
but we can also see that Christ makes this passage important by quoting the tail end of verse 3 in his temptations
